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This talk page is for discussing the Pay-to-play Fishing training page.

UntitledEdit

wow not a bad guide heck i think untill they update fishing it is 100% complete save for rewording and style stuff!!!!

What about stealing creation harpoons with tuna/swordfish, plus the variable of swordfish gloves. Would this be faster/more profitable than fly fishing?--Kodeman76 01:40, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

I tried sacred clay harpoon and swordfish at about lvl55 fishing, with very little exp gain compared to Baxtorian falls. I guess it could prove efficient at a higher level, as swordfish are slowly caught at this low lvl. Delapaco 23:00, November 28, 2009 (UTC)

Cavefish Edit

Discussion about cavefish xp/h and cash as compared to monkfish. Many say they are actually better, anyone has any rates of xp per hour of cavefish?

foolish to gut fishes? Edit

The guide says that it would be foolish to gut fishes as "there are better cooking exp" and "the time saved could be used for something more productive later". But i have reasons to disagree, gutting fishes wouldn't take very long and it saves a lot of clicking. You would probably gut all the fishes by the time you drop all of them,maybe even faster.--Moneypony 19:35, November 7, 2009 (UTC)

The Fastest method to do it, as stated, was to fish a signle fish and then discard the fish and start fishing again. Fsih 1, drop 1 is a really effective technique, albeit a pretty annoying one, as unlike other fishing, requires your full attention. -KingBlackChicken

Karambwans are effective in getting 99?Edit

Part of the guide says Fishing Karambwans are amonsgt the fastest methods to achieve 99 Fishing. But after seeing th information, I quite doubt, here's my reason - 1. One Karambwan gives 105 xp only opposed to the 120 of Monkfish or even 110 of Sharks. and monkfishes can be caught at level 62, Karambwans require 65) 2. The bait required is quite specific - raw Karambwanji which must be fished in deeper Karamja, making it quite hard to train on. 3. Karambwans are also known to quite often take the fish and leave the vessel, leaving the player no fish and, of course, no experience. 4. The nearest bank from where they could fish Karambwans are either in Ardgougne through the ship, banker Depositer near Tai Bwo Wannai or the bank in Shilo Village, none of those are close enough for effective banking.

Rainbow fish same exp as leaping sturgeon Edit

what about Rainbow fish? they are fly fishing exclusive fish that are same exp as sturgeon and tuna. it should be the fastest way to 99 and u can start fishing it at 38.

Sacred Harpoon?Edit

Considering this quote: "Fishing gloves or the sacred harpoon alone are great for training fishing, however when together, they cancel each other out and it would be best to only use one" and information from the surrounding text, it seems very contradictory. Sacred Harpoons cause the rate of fishing to decline, thus causing an overall decrease in average XP gain. The article states that Swordfish Gloves combined with Sacred Harpoons cancel each other out, when in reality based on the data and knowledge of the article, they only cancel out the disadvantage incurred by the Sacred Harpoon's decrease in fishing rate, not each other in its entirety, theoretically. Thus the statement that using either Gloves or a Harpoon alone is great for training fishing makes no sense, as the Sacred Harpoon without Gloves causes your average XP rate to decrease lower than that of without either item, and since the amount of time needed to obtain Swordfish Gloves as explained by the article isn't worthwhile, I'm led to believe that advising any inclusion of Gloves or Sacred Harpoons for training Fishing would be at a complete and absolute loss, whether you combine them or use either alone. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but remember I'm using 100% of the information from the article to deduce this.70.233.153.167 23:55, June 21, 2010 (UTC)

You're right in saying that the use of both cancels out the damage incurred by the decreased fishing rate of the harpoon, but that doesn't make the use of both better than the use of either alone. The use of the harpoon alone will increase the rate of experience, not by the expected 100%, buy instead only by about 33% because of the decreased fishing rate. The use of gloves alone will increase the rate of experience by 100% because the fishing rate is unaffected. The use of both together will still only increase the rate of experience by 100% because of the reasons explained in the article. As you can see, using them together would be a waste of a sacred clay harpoon. The rate of experience while using both is better than the rate of experience of the harpoon alone, but it is not better than the rate of experience of the gloves alone. Seeing as you already have the gloves, using the harpoon as well would be a waste.

I will note, however, that the variable of primary significance here, fishing rate of the harpoon, is not accepted by all to be decreased by 33%. It has not yet been proven by either side of the debate. With this in mind, I propose a test. I suggest someone measure the amount of time it takes them to fish swordfish and tuna with the sacred clay harpoon until the tool is completely used up from 100% charges. Then, fish for the same amount of time with an ordinary harpoon, barb tailed harpoon, or barbarian fishing methods. If the amount of experience recieved while using the sacred clay harpoon is increased by about 33%, then the information posted in the article is correct. If it is instead increased by about 100%, or the same amount of fish are recieved from the each test, then we can assume the posted information false and begin to correct the information on this page and all others where the sacred clay harpoon is mentioned.Quest point capeSk8r dan man Quests 08:33, June 20, 2010 (UTC) In the future, please try to remember to sign your posts on the talk page.


Sorry for not signing. Your response seems a little faulty.

"The use of the harpoon alone will increase the rate of experience, not by the expected 100%, buy instead only by about 33% because of the decreased fishing rate." The article states that the same amount of experience can be obtained from 3 attempts of fishing without the harpoon to the 2 attempts of fishing with the harpoon and gloves both in equally allotted times. This indicates that the expected increase or decrease in a rate of average XP gain is 0%. So once you remove the gloves then your average XP gain dips below 0%, causing a decline in average XP gain. To further your response regarding the 33% variable, you can extend a simulation of the given scenario over infinitesimally long intervals for what this article probably assumes to be a VERY favorable 0% average. Your assessment also ignores the 20+ minutes spent obtaining the harpoon. Given the simulation intervals, gathering the necessary harpoons for comparison can reach astronomically time-lengthy amounts, causing an even greater nightmare of XP reduction.

"As you can see, using them together would be a waste of a sacred clay harpoon." As you can see from the article and from what I just said, using a harpoon for any reason whatsoever would be a waste of your time, gloves or no gloves, thus this quote is technically correct, but not for the right reasons.

"The rate of experience while using both is better than the rate of experience of the harpoon alone, but it is not better than the rate of experience of the gloves alone." I agree. Unfortunately the time required obtaining the gloves is, as indicated, not worthwhile for efficient average fishing XP results.

What I was trying to convey earlier was the specific quote: "Fishing gloves or the sacred harpoon alone are great for training fishing". As once again repeated here, sacred harpoons are a complete waste of time, thus they couldn't be great for training fishing alone. Fishing gloves take too long to obtain, thus shouldn't be an advised fishing-training tool. And using either together is completely null. So again I ask: why is either item recommended at all whatsoever for training fishing?70.233.153.167 23:55, June 21, 2010 (UTC)


It seems you misunderstand what is stated in the article, though I can't blame you because the article is a bit unclear and could use revision. The (potential) amount of expereince gained from 2 attempts with both the harpoon and gloves is 600; which is equal to the (potential) amount of experience gained from the 3 attempts made with just gloves in an equal amount of time. The increased rate of about 33% (after you've already obtained the harpoon) of the harpoon is not directly indicated in the article, but it was calculated based on information stated in the article. The (potential) amount of expereince gained from 2 attempts with the harpoon alone is 400; which is about 33% more than the (potential) 300 experience gained from the 3 attempts made with neither gloves, nor a sacred clay harpoon in an equal amount of time. With this information, I expect you will find my response to be less faulty than it seems. I still encourage that we preform tests similar to the one I described in my last response before we preform too many more calculations based on what may be inaccurate information.

You also address the consern of whether or not the increased rate of experience after obtaining the harpoons makes up for the time required to obtain them. This can also be calculated pretty easily. Because the increased experience is 33% (assuming the untested theory is correct) the amount of time required to obtain the harpoon must be less than 33% of the amount time that the harpoon lasts in order for them to have an effective increase. For most players, the amount of time required to obtain a harpoon is a little more than 20 minutes (including waiting time between games). This means that for the amount of time that a sacred clay harpoon lasts, must be over an hour, which might be true for some who fish sharks (requires testing). However, for some who play no combat games with clans to obtain their sacred clay tools, it may only take about 12-18 minutes to obtain one harpoon. In this case, the tool only has to last more than 36-54 minutes for the harpoons to be effective. Still, these times seem to be somewhat longer than sacred harpoons harpoons usually last. This leads me to further believe that the information posted is likely incorrect and is in great need of testing.

If the information is incorrect and the animation time has no effect on the fishing rate, then amount of time required to obtain the harpoon must be less than 100% of the amount time that the harpoon lasts in order for them to have an effective increase. This means that the sacred clay harpoons must last more than 12-20+ minutes for them to be effective, which seems very probable for most players who use harpoons.

Calculating whether or not swordfish or shark gloves are useful is much more difficult. There are too many variables that have significantly different values for many players. The most various is the amount of time required to obtain a pair of gloves. A good player who can consistantly win many games very quickly might find the gloves useful; whereas for most average or poor players, they will usually prove wasteful (of either time, tokens, or both).

To answer your question, "why is either item recommended at all whatsoever for training fishing?" I say they are recommended based on many assumptions. We should preform more tests and calculations to support these assumptions with conclusive evidence. Then we should clarify in the article when they are recommended, and when they are wasteful, and why.Quest point capeSk8r dan man Quests 15:20, June 22, 2010 (UTC)

Rocktail to 99?Edit

That would be incredibly slow if you started to fish rocktail straight away and i doubt youd get the 40k p/h xp that is advertised good money yes but not the bext xp p/h until you can catch them faster. So I would advise adding sharks as an alternative to 99. Defence cape (t) Rabbit FearArmadyl godsword 21:10, October 16, 2010 (UTC)

Barbarian Fishing/AlchingEdit

After half an hour of trying to achieve the effect of having my inventory over the fishing spot, I discovered that you have to zoom to 50% to make the window skinny enough. I'm not sure how other browsers operate (I'm using Internet Explorer) and that wall of text is a bit discouraging, so I'm going to try to fix it as best as I can, with numbered steps. Lefthandedkid 02:38, December 24, 2010 (UTC)

Equipment portion changeEdit

I changed the the equipment portion

  • split out the fishing gloves from fist of guthix into it's own section.
  • took out weasel statement and made the paragraphs read as if it was from one person
  • Took the note that was at the bottom of the sacred clay harpoon section and made it into it's own section called power fishing. Had no clue what to call it or where to put it but it seemed like it needed to be left in.
  • Went into a little more detail about fishing urns. Still think this could be improved.

Hopefully it wasn't too aggressive. Quest Darrik Ash US serv HS ALDarklight detail 15:56, April 29, 2011 (UTC)

C2 FishingEdit

I was looking at the Rocktail page and at the bottom it says it's the fifth fastest... But it says that C2 Fishing is 120k/hour. I've never gotten that much before, nor do I see anything else on the entire Wiki explaining how to get 120k/hour. Forum moderator crownFerrelShadowSlayer 12:23, September 6, 2011 (UTC)

Value of Time Playing SCEdit

The second paragraph of the "Sacred Clay" section states: "Each game can last 20 minutes with no guarantee of earning enough points to purchase a harpoon. This makes Stealing Creation worth roughly 35,000 fishing experience or less in worst-case scenarios. This number rises with faster turnaround times of Stealing Creation, but only to roughly 70,000 experience given a 10-minute game."

There needs to be some explanation of where the numbers here come from. Further, there needs to be some legitimacy to the numbers. Right now, the only variable considered is the average duration of a game of Stealing Creation, which ignores (1) the player's Fishing level, (2) the method the player would otherwise be using, and (3) the average points earned per game of Stealing Creation. Lord Red XII 04:00, May 16, 2012 (UTC)

Shark Fishing FiguresEdit

The Shark figures do seem completely out for in the fishing page,

"Sharks deserve some small mention as one of the most popular money making fish to catch. Despite this, sharks are a very poor training method, giving about half the xp/hr of comparable methods such as monkfish or cavefish (only 20k/hour), with a negligible increase in profit. Fishing sharks is not recommended. However, the profit as of June 2012 can excel 100m every 65 hours of shark fishing."

Just on a quick scan through, I found this. This is estimating profit of over 1.5M an hour shark fishing, assuming 99 I guess. Ask a little bit blown up if you ask me? can anybody give input on actual figures as I currently can't test this, and what I can only guess is false information is on the main page Baragehybrid

That's definitely impossible. 1.5M/hour at current prices would require catching 2.7k sharks per hour, which is one shark every 1.3 seconds. Deleting that figure accordingly. Lord Red XII 20:49, June 20, 2012 (UTC)

RestructuringEdit

I tried to modify the article but my changes were rejected (I think I made too many).

I suggest the article is reworked as follows, first showing the fastest path to 99 fishing, and then listing possible money making methods.

Fishing for exp:

1-5: Crayfish

5-20: Bait Fish

20-42: Fly fishing

42-99: Barbarian fishing

Extra mentions:

62+ Fish Fingers

All levels: Stealing creation

80+: C2 fishing

Fising for Money:

Lobsters

Monkfish

Sharks

Rockfish  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 128.54.182.206 (talk) on 23:33, February 26, 2015 (UTC).

Changes to the guide (April 2015)Edit

Levels 1-20

When I tested these levels crayfish were much faster than shrimps: I got levels 1-5 in ~2minutes at crayfish but it took around 8/9minutes fishing shrimps. For levels 5-10 it took around 4 minutes to get the levels at crayfish, and 10 minutes fishing sardine. For levels 10-20 I found it took about the same time using either crayfish or herring and sardine or shrimps and anchovies (15-20). I thought it would be faster for players to stay at the same location for these levels, crayfish additionally do not require bait and are easier to drop being the only kind of fish caught from their fishing spots.

Fly fishing/barb fishing

Prior to level 58 (ability to catch leaping salmon as well as leaping trout) fly fishing gives more experience an hour than barbarian fishing. At level 57 I got 5600 experience in 10 minutes (33600 an hour) barbarian fishing and 19830/15 minutes fly fishing (47592 an hour). At level 58 both methods start to give equivalent xp. At level 58 I got 15430 experience in 20 minutes (46290 an hour) while fly fishing and 23470 experience in 29 minutes barbarian fishing (48558).

Scrimshaws

I calculated the bonus experience for barbarian fishing as this:

At level 99 players gain ~80000 experience an hour. The average experience per fish caught is 106 (average of all 3 types of fish). 80,000/106 = 754 fish caught an hour. 15% of fish caught give bonus experience = 15% of 754 = 113. The average additional experience per big fish is 36 (average of all 3 additional experience amounts). 113x36=4068.

At level 70 players gain ~63000 experience an hour. 63,000/106 = 594. 15% of 594 = 89. 89x36=3204.

For rocktails:

At level 99 ~120 rocktails are caught an hour. 15% of 120 = 18 Additional experience per big fish is 200. 18*200 = 3,600 (48600/hr).

If using a scrimshaw players would have deposit rocktails at the pulley lift. Players could catch 27 rocktails an inventory (holding bait). 120/27= 4+ inventories an hour. + 4 minutes for banking = 48600/64 minutes = 45562.5/hr.

Cavefish

These gave me 42900 experience in an hour at level 99. I got 143 cavefish.

Rocktails and barbarian fishing

Although rocktails base experience rate is much slower than barbarian fishing, experience rates at rocktails can be improved considerably using experience boosting items. When using a legendary call of the sea aura, fishing outfit, granite lobsters, urns and scrimshaw (scrimshaw only on barb fishing) at level 99 barbarian fishing was around 115k/hr and rocktails were 92k/hr. Using skillchompas as well as these things was ~105k/hr at rocktails and 128k/hr barbarian fishing.

As mentioned on the skillchompas’ talk page, using lower tiers of skillchompa still provides a good bonus to fishing xp. For example with rocktails I got ~88k xp/hr using crimson skillchompas but I also got ~80k/hr using viridian skillchompas.

Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 20:12, April 15, 2015 (UTC)

More information neededEdit

  • Xp rate for cavefish at level 85
  • Xp rate for cavefish at level 90
  • Xp rate for rocktails at level 90
  • Fill in xp rates for table on barbarian fishing

Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 20:12, April 15, 2015 (UTC)

  • Xp rate for using crystallise and light form for fly fishing at level 70 Fishing.
None of the quests required for The Light Within seem to have a Fishing level requirement, so it may be possible to use crystallise before 70.
Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 14:00, September 11, 2015 (UTC)

CrystalliseEdit

Added information about Crystallise. At level 99 Fishing:

  • Fly fishing (using crystallise & light form) - 39323/20m = 117,969
  • Fly fishing (using crystallise & light form, POH decoration, fishing outfit, superior scrimshaw, granite lobster, legendary aura and decorated urns) - 66097/30m = 132,194
  • Barbarian fishing (using POH decoration, fishing outfit, superior scrimshaw, granite lobster, legendary aura and decorated urns) - 58,732/30m = 117,464

Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 14:00, September 11, 2015 (UTC)

Prifddinas waterfall fishingEdit

Added some basic information about this. The experience rate is based off 30 minutes of Fishing using no boosts and without doing any of the random events (46,200/30m > 92,400/hr).

Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 12:28, September 21, 2015 (UTC)

With crimson skillchompas - 152,808/hr, 1462 crimson skillchompas gained and 341 large urchins gained. Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 15:28, September 21, 2015 (UTC)
With legendary aura - 91,000/46m + large 325 urchins = 118,696/hr, Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 16:20, September 21, 2015 (UTC)
More XP rates:
  • Prif - 216,150/2hr + 625 urchins = 108,075 + 312 urchins/937 urchin points.
  • Prif (using fishing outfit, legendary aura, granite lobster, superior scrimshaw, urns, perfect fishing juju and crystal fishing rod) - 159,287/53m + 280 urchins = 180,325/hr
  • Fly fishing (using crystallise & light form, fishing outfit, legendary aura, granite lobster, superior scrimshaw, urns, perfect fishing juju and crystal fishing rod) - 26,609/11.5m = 138,830/hr

Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 17:03, September 22, 2015 (UTC)

Prawn PerksEdit

Should the effects of Prawn Perks be added? Some of the effects, such as fly fish without using feather and Barbarian fish without bait or feathers, may be useful to training fishing.Alphachan (talk) 06:21, July 23, 2016 (UTC)

These are mentioned under "Aquarium" :) Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 09:08, July 23, 2016 (UTC)

Menaphos Port FishingEdit

Does the Menaphos port fishing beat Barbarian fishing?

96.41.146.205 07:46, June 7, 2017 (UTC)

So far no one has contributed any xp rates for us to know. Magic logs detailIsobelJRaw rocktail detail 15:45, June 7, 2017 (UTC)

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